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Thread: Volvo semi-truck automatic braking system

  1. #11
    Flirting With The Redline 8000 Posts! Trials's Avatar
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    Let me know when the stats start showing it's safer to be a good motorcycle rider then it is to be a bad pedestrian.

  2. #12
    Moderator/RiderCoach We've stopped counting... Missy B's Avatar
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    I know this thread has diverted a bit from the original post but wanted to chime in...
    I manage the mc and CDL training programs and as such, we recently toured the autonomous semi truck company here in town. VERY interesting stuff. And there's A LOT of money in this research so I really can't see it going away.

    I talked with the driver and asked him why he got involved with the company since drivers are typically up in arms about the whole thing. He said with the number of images they capture A SECOND, and with the data they are collecting, he was not concerned about the liability being put on him as a driver as long as he does his job.

    I was really interested for Uber to respond to the death. I'm glad they released the video and are being transparent. I think there is a lot to learn from this. It seems she was distracted by something but how many of us, as drivers, would have seen that lady crossing the street, and reacted quickly enough to not hit her, even if not distracted?
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  3. #13
    Flirting With The Redline 10,000 Posts! Shadow Shack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trials View Post
    Let me know when the stats start showing it's safer to be a good motorcycle rider then it is to be a bad pedestrian.
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  4. #14
    Flirting With The Redline 10,000 Posts! Shadow Shack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missy B View Post
    I was really interested for Uber to respond to the death. I'm glad they released the video and are being transparent. I think there is a lot to learn from this. It seems she was distracted by something but how many of us, as drivers, would have seen that lady crossing the street, and reacted quickly enough to not hit her, even if not distracted?
    Is there a new release stating that the vehicle was not in self-drive mode? I only ask as everything I've read says the vehicle was in self-drive mode at the time of impact and that the brakes were not activated until after the impact. With the entire argument of autonomous vehicles being that the reaction time is much quicker, it's certainly a fair question...more so in the way it was traveling at above the posted speed limit.
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  5. #15
    RiderCoach 4000 Posts! AZridered's Avatar
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    A key factor to determine is exactly how the vehicle's detection systems failed to register the woman and her bicycle.

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  6. #16
    Moderator/RiderCoach We've stopped counting... Missy B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Shack View Post
    Is there a new release stating that the vehicle was not in self-drive mode? I only ask as everything I've read says the vehicle was in self-drive mode at the time of impact and that the brakes were not activated until after the impact. With the entire argument of autonomous vehicles being that the reaction time is much quicker, it's certainly a fair question...more so in the way it was traveling at above the posted speed limit.
    No, but I'm assuming that drivers can override the self driving mode and that's why they are there? For when they need to take over? Kinda like deactivating cruise control?
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  7. #17
    Flirting With The Redline 10,000 Posts! Shadow Shack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZridered View Post
    A key factor to determine is exactly how the vehicle's detection systems failed to register the woman and her bicycle.

    I don't recall where it was said but there were several references along the way stating the self-driving cars had difficulty in seeing motorcycles, which is why the question of pedestrians was posted since they have an even smaller visual profile.

    Watching the Uber video this all occurred in the right lane...you can see the cyclist moving from the left lane into the right prior to impact. So the previous reports how the pedestrian/bicycle "suddenly jumped off the curb" are total B.S...she was in the middle of the road and in clearly within sensor range per se. Yes, she was shrouded in shadow and hard to see...but the way the autonomous vehicle designers were dislocating their shoulders while patting themselves on their own backs at the way these sensors "will detect such anomalies" (while at the same time admitting they have a hard time detecting motorcycles), obviously this isn't the case and it all needs to go back to formula.


    Quote Originally Posted by Missy B View Post
    No, but I'm assuming that drivers can override the self driving mode and that's why they are there? For when they need to take over? Kinda like deactivating cruise control?
    I would presume as much too. Sadly the "driver" fell for the same safety crutch that all the other systems provide: "ABS, traction control, auto parallel park, self-lane correction, auto-braking...all of this enables me to safely text while driving."

    Which, consequently, was exactly what the "operator" was doing while the car was self-driving. Then again that's exactly why the self-driving came to be...catch 22. When you allow a system to go public that has been demonstrated to be faulty (re: has trouble detecting motorcycles, and consequently the even smaller profile pedestrians that they didn't admit to), it's pretty clear where the liability falls.
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  8. #18
    Flirting With The Redline Mad Matt's Avatar
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    In my mind that liability is the biggest barrier to the widespread adoption of self-driving vehicles.

    There doesnít seem to be much doubt that we can make a bot drive better than your average semi-competent and distracted human. From a public health point of view, itís probably a net gain to get people out of the driversí seats. But all that liability which is currently diffused among millions of drivers will instead be concentrated on the manufacturers. I donít think theyíre ready for that.

  9. #19
    Flirting With The Redline 10,000 Posts! Shadow Shack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Matt View Post
    I donít think theyíre ready for that.
    Yet they unleashed a system with a known flaw upon the public anyways...
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  10. #20
    RiderCoach 4000 Posts! AZridered's Avatar
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    My bicycle club's route took us past the site of the crash. There are a few factors which seem to have not made the news. While it has been reported that the victim was 'not in a crosswalk' features constructed by the city certainly make it appear that there should be a crosswalk. Just south of Curry, Mill Avenue is split into separate northbound and southbound lanes. There is a landscaped median between the lanes and there are pretty clearly, paved, constructed paths, crossing the median. Landscaping in the median means that pedestrians walking on these two paths (they are in an X shape) are largely obscured from view. Add the fact that this area has minimal lighting and the problem becomes worse. The city has put up 'don't cross here' signs, but that is kind of lame when you consider that these are very, very, clearly constructed as foot paths. As for the Uber's speed, it was indeed in a 35 mph zone and was about to enter a 45 mph zone. 38 mph is not unreasonable to expect at that point.

    Check it on Google Maps. Look for Mill and Curry, Tempe, AZ. If you have the map oriented with 'up' being North, the lady was crossing from the SW to NE cross path and was struck just before the right side fog line changes from solid to broken. Now factor in that the speed limit has traffic moving at a bit more than 50 feet per second.

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