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View Full Version : News: Military signs treaty - with bike dealers



mediajackl
09-13-2005, 09:34 AM
Base brass says its weary of seeing soldiers become casualties from motorcycling, apparently a big problem.

Excerpt:
"Garrison commander Col. Larry D. Ruggley said he praised the dealerships for their coming together to help soldiers by not trying to sell them more bike than they can handle.
"The last thing we want to do is send soldiers to Iraq only to have them come home and be taken advantage of by businesses who only think about the bottom line," Ruggley said."

(sound like a familiar refrain?)


http://www.theleafchronicle.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050907/NEWS01/509070316&SearchID=73220160624258

Jack_R1
09-13-2005, 09:55 AM
It's indeed an ethic thing, and a smart one, IMHO.

Worth spreading on other forums - just did.

Chrystal
09-13-2005, 12:10 PM
Dude. Take it from me - If the government wants a treaty...RUN!

subvetSSN606
09-13-2005, 02:54 PM
Dude. Take it from me - If the government wants a treaty...RUN!

ROFLMAO!!

Tom

remy_marathe
09-13-2005, 03:16 PM
Hmmm... one group that should already understand the importance of being knowledgeable, trained, and safe in the handling of serious tools and machinery. Unless of course we're pulling our military straight from young males fresh out of high-school, recruiting people that are easy to sell and influence, and running ads that appeal to thrill-seekers. Then, this phenomenon would make perfect sense...

I think it's nice that some dealerships are doing that, even if only for some good press, but pretty sad that a solution should be sought in the vendors. The last ones who should (or will) bear the responsibility for making wise purchasing decisions.

NYRobG
09-13-2005, 04:53 PM
Hmmm... one group that should already understand the importance of being knowledgeable, trained, and safe in the handling of serious tools and machinery. Unless of course we're pulling our military straight from young males fresh out of high-school, recruiting people that are easy to sell and influence, and running ads that appeal to thrill-seekers. Then, this phenomenon would make perfect sense...


Ummmmm, Remy?

a) Why are the two groups mutually exclusive?

b) How many college eduacated, genteel, mature and adult private E-1's do you think our military is going to be able to recruit for less than $1,000 per month in wages?

I signed up under the Delayed Entry Program at 16 1/2 and completed basic training before I was 18. I had been kind of a juvenille delinquent as a teenager. The Army life taught me some pretty hard lessons, but it also gave me an opportunity that I wouldn't have had otherwise. Was I the model of maturity during my time in the service? No, I was still kind of wild, but I did the job (and did it well) and served my time honorably.

I should also mention that I purchased a 1981 Harley Sturgis from a guy I was stationed with in Germany in 1983. The bike was too much for me to handle at the time, as I had never ridden before, and after almost killing myself on various Autobahns a few times I sold it and didn't ride again until 2002, when I bought a Yamaha 650 and took an MSF course (which is now mandated prior to riding on a military reservation, I understand).

I guess what I don't understand is what you're comments are alluding to? Are you pointing to a societal problem in our military?

--Rob

remy_marathe
09-13-2005, 05:28 PM
I was more just observing the fact that the same personality traits that make for squiddly riding are actively sought after by our military to fill their ranks. And the same malleability and acquiescence to authority figures is what allows salespeople to control their customers. I do find something ethically wrong with the way we've been recruiting lately, particularly in the blatant associations between video-games and service that you see in their television ads and the anathematic "An Army of One" slogan, but that's another story. I was just pointing out my sudden recognition of why it should be that so many military personnel return from duty and go and get themselves killed on overpowered bikes, since at first it struck me as an odd phenomenon.

As for societal problems in our military, I guess being a troublemaker with a job and the potential to learn some responsibilities, and eventual technical training if you live, is better than just being a troublemaker (no sarcasm there). The military doesn't create the problem, but it certainly harnesses it to the purposes of those in charge. And I guess therein lies my objection, entirely unrelated to anything on this thread.

MsPotatoPotatoHead
09-13-2005, 05:57 PM
It DOES make sense that the military has a lot of adrenaline junkies, the same kind of person who'd indulge in squidly riding behavior. Especially considering the recruiting tactics of late. Good observation, Remy.

asp125
09-13-2005, 06:11 PM
A step in the right direction, but unfortunately this tactic doesn't fully address the problem; only if the bike is bought from a dealer. Private sales and salvage title bikes especially, appeal to the young risk taking crowd since they (the bikes) are usually cheap and available as stunt bikes. The overriding factor is that the recruits feel a sense of invincibility after mastering machines like tanks and fighter aircraft, or after dodging bullets and IEDs they want to live life to the fullest. That mindset usually plays into the high powered sportbike or big cruiser for a first bike syndrome.

x_cuesme
09-13-2005, 08:49 PM
An 18 year old that is willing to face a bullet has more than his or her share of "I'm infallible'- anything that cuts down on the super bikes for new riders is a good thing IMHO.

A factor that needs to be taken into consideration regarding young recruits buying big, over-powered bikes is their ability to do so.

Military members have secure jobs and a Commander that is going to be real upset if they don't pay their bills- Makes them a better than average credit risk.

The reason my son's bike- who is in the Army- is financed in my name is because of the interest rate they were going to charge him- NOT because he couldn't get credit. In his name, 15%- in mine, 3.9%.

Course, the good side of that is Army Boy rides a V-Star 650...cuz Mom had a say so in size if she was signing the dotted line...(and he had a year's experience on a Honda 750 beater before he bought the new one!)

NYRobG
09-13-2005, 09:32 PM
I was more just observing the fact that the same personality traits that make for squiddly riding are actively sought after by our military to fill their ranks. And the same malleability and acquiescence to authority figures is what allows salespeople to control their customers. I do find something ethically wrong with the way we've been recruiting lately, particularly in the blatant associations between video-games and service that you see in their television ads and the anathematic "An Army of One" slogan, but that's another story. I was just pointing out my sudden recognition of why it should be that so many military personnel return from duty and go and get themselves killed on overpowered bikes, since at first it struck me as an odd phenomenon.

As for societal problems in our military, I guess being a troublemaker with a job and the potential to learn some responsibilities, and eventual technical training if you live, is better than just being a troublemaker (no sarcasm there). The military doesn't create the problem, but it certainly harnesses it to the purposes of those in charge. And I guess therein lies my objection, entirely unrelated to anything on this thread.

Wow. Second paragraph, notsomuch with the love, huh? Kind of hard not to feel just a little bit offended since the prototypical soldier you describe was essentially me, as I described it. I was an MP (you could say that was a responsible job) I can even type and read and everything. I did get some training. I'm currently working on my second Master of Science degree. So yeah, I got a little training.

I'm not going to defend "Big Green" for coming up with a better recruiting campaign than "Be all you can be" which is the catchy little ditty that must have gotten me to enlist. Though, I have to ask, do you honestly think people join the military because of a song or a logo or a phrase?

What would you have the Defense Department do? "Well, our jobs are inherently more dangerous than most, so let's just close up shop. Call the President and tell him we're going home."

"Wait a minute. I have a better idea. Let's find a way to get some really sexy music, graphics, and a catch phrase. Then we'll go out and try and recruit the little kids right out of their homes."

remy_marathe
09-14-2005, 06:22 AM
What would you have the Defense Department do? "Well, our jobs are inherently more dangerous than most, so let's just close up shop. Call the President and tell him we're going home."

"Wait a minute. I have a better idea. Let's find a way to get some really sexy music, graphics, and a catch phrase. Then we'll go out and try and recruit the little kids right out of their homes."

The second half of that is what I have a problem with. I know you're being sarcastic there, but that's essentially what the military's television propaganda campaign has been and I think it's wrong. As you know, there are plenty of good, moral reasons to serve.

I didn't mean to belittle you or your service, and if I did, I apologize. Like I said, there was no sarcasm there. My father was an extra mouth to feed in his family in Pittsburgh, and a general "troublemaker" as well (convicted of manslaughter for the results of a barfight, in one instance). He lied about his age at 17, enlisted and eventually saw action in the pacific theater. As a boiler-room engineer, he was able to provide for our family. I have the utmost respect for what he was and did.

Let's let it go at that, because I can promise you and I won't see eye to eye on what the military should be.

Sparky
09-14-2005, 07:20 AM
The connection between soldiers and motorcycles seems pretty old. The biker clubs of the late 40's and 50's were mostly made up of WWII vets, weren't they?

As for the "Army of One" campaign and use of first person shooters as recruitment tools... Nothing new there. Armies have always recruited volunteers by promising adventure, travel to foreign lands, and opportunity to do certain things young people usually are not encouraged to do (like shoot guns or wheelie tanks over a ditch). This is just a modern form of a message that's existed since one proto-amphibian said to another proto-amphibian "Alright, marine, take that beach. Win one for our genus. HOOOORAH!"

;)

Sparky

NYRobG
09-14-2005, 07:29 AM
The connection between soldiers and motorcycles seems pretty old. The biker clubs of the late 40's and 50's were mostly made up of WWII vets, weren't they?...

;)

Sparky


Yep. The Boozefighters MC was the club that caused the orgination of the 1%er label that is now the monkier of many, if not all, outlaw MC's. They were completely comprised of WWII vets.

Remy?

OK we'll let it go.